I think you have taken corky bells statement out of context.

It is possible that a pump may only generate a pressure of 60psi at a low flow rate according to the pump curves (manufacturers operating points of a pump) but as soon as you install it in a fuel rail in car the situation is very different.

The pump tries to maintain a constant pressure in the rail despite the injectors leaking all the fuel out to the engine. If the leaks get too big (high rpm/boost require higher quantities of fuel per second) the pump will no longer maintain the pressure in the rail. Once you start mapping cars and converting the injector squirt time per revolution you soon see how fuel flow (litres per secong or hour) requirements increase and darrys statement that fuel pressure will drop off at high rpm/boost first is spot on.

Another aspect... And maybe to clarify for darryl - I believe you stuck to the same rolling road for both runs (mapping and power run). This is a dunk dynamics rr and there is 2 possible operating conditions.

Dyno shoot out mode does not measure drivetrain loss but uses a standard correction for a typical 4wd.
For mapping they can select to measure drivetrain loss during the run down.

If you have/had a dragging clutch or binding brakes the tx Loss could be higher than average tweaking your original figures up.

_________________
JP
GT4DC Treasurer

Grey St185 RC
Silver BMW E46 M3
Multicolour yawn Honda VFR400
Silver Honda Civic Type-R

Oh, darryl makes some bloody good points - especially regarding cam timing and shape of curve. Why didn't I think of that! Obvious now he says it.

To be fair I think darryl is the most knowledgeable on here regarding engine operating parameters and impacts.

What temp is the trd stat rated at? The logs show a consistent 84 deg c which is a but higher than I remember. Still sensible though and not a number that would cause major corrections to be applied I would think.

_________________
JP
GT4DC Treasurer

Grey St185 RC
Silver BMW E46 M3
Multicolour yawn Honda VFR400
Silver Honda Civic Type-R

I can only go with the efi temp saying its reading correctly due to being richer on cold start up and the pfc showing 85'c and the fans come on as they should, the middle bit I have no idea?
I will swap this back and try it.
Trd stat was fitted after it was mapped.

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Steve Gillies
ST-165 88 UK

www.GT4-Play.co.uk

The fans if still wired as stock have their own temp switch to turn on. / off.

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

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Darryl

Having read the whole thread again, I'd say the temp sensor should be first port of call, then run the stock ecu (confirming your wideband) then back to your PFC. And give us some AFR reading once we've seen the stock AFR numbers to compare against.
Then go back to the current ( new temp sensor ) and do same checks with stock ecu & PFC and post numbers.

Sent from my HTC One X using Tapatalk 2

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Darryl

Just to add SRR AFR's show the same as my AFR gauge, this can also be seen by the colour of my spark plugs, picture can be seen in the Flickr link above.

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Steve Gillies
ST-165 88 UK

www.GT4-Play.co.uk

Hi Darryl, Sure this is why I'm happy that the efi temp sensor is correct at uts upper limit at least, as the fans should come on at 85'c which is what the PFC is showing.

Thanks for taking the time to help out.

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Steve Gillies
ST-165 88 UK

www.GT4-Play.co.uk

My gut feeling is that there were issues with the car or dyno/equipment when the car was mapped that have subsequently been resolved. Ryan would have mapped what was in front of him at the time. The fact he couldn't get closed loop working indicates an issue.
what did he use to read afr ? Was it just the srr kit shoved up the exhaust ? Any exhaust leak can skew this reading. I did a dyno day there a couple of years back and it read richer than my ageing wideband which I already suspected was reading rich. I weakened the mixture a bit on the strength of that and the car felt much quicker but melted a piston a few days later.
it may be you have been running 13:1 all along and getting away with it due to good cooling mods/forged pistons.
the power difference could be down to gear used for the run. Does the car feel slower now ? Do you have any track times to compare ?

_________________
If at first you don't suck seed, try drier grain.

If I switch O2 back on and refit it will the ecu be happy to run with it?
I can monitor the AFR now as well.

_________________
Steve Gillies
ST-165 88 UK

www.GT4-Play.co.uk

Probably but don't bugger with anything else until you have resolved your current issues.

_________________
JP
GT4DC Treasurer

Grey St185 RC
Silver BMW E46 M3
Multicolour yawn Honda VFR400
Silver Honda Civic Type-R

I too think the AFR back at the first mapping might have been out of spec. The 13:1 would have given good power, but of course ignore that this time a couple of years later its 30bhp down. As said good cooling and forged might have saved your engine.... But for how much longer ?

Has anyone got the stock fan turn on then back off temps ? They would be several degrees above the normal window.
Is. For stock thermo stat 82.c ? The radiator fan wouldn't turn on until say 95 and then off once down to say 85. But that's the temp of the coolant in the radiator.... Is on stock rad, at the end of the cooling flow down through it. The water temp for the ecu is normally on the elbow off the head that could be quite a bit warmer. I've certainly seen big temp difference from top to bottom of my radiator. ( meaning its working lol )

Overnight cool down the water temp should be close to ambient before startup..... That's one starting point if you can't measure temps apart from ecu readout. Remove sensor and stick in a kettle of boiling water, that gives you 100.c confirm what the PFC says for those two temps.

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Darryl

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Darryl

OK...

Swapped out the EFi Temp sensor measuring the Resistance on the way.

25 Year old Stock EFi Temp sensor 2.68 Ohms
New (ish) bought this year 2.39 Ohms

imo nothing much different here...

went for a drive and noticed no change to AFR.

Fitted a st205 ECU and the car is running in the 10's!! Fuel pressure remains the same with out dropping, boost was set at around 1Bar

https://www.dropbox.com/s/w4g0aqb54h59u ... .29.48.mov

https://www.dropbox.com/s/e0y68vfdb9i12 ... .32.22.mov

Looks like a visit for a remap...
I do wonder what has changed or what was set-up incorrectly in 2009?

I guess its still doesn't make sense with the power being down?

_________________
Steve Gillies
ST-165 88 UK

www.GT4-Play.co.uk

_________________
If at first you don't suck seed, try drier grain.

Sorry Chris, Missed this bit.

The car feels the same going from a hard standing start up through the gears but possibly not a sperky with in gear acceleration? hard to say.
No track times to compare im afraid.

_________________
Steve Gillies
ST-165 88 UK

www.GT4-Play.co.uk

Very few people can feel less than 10% power change..... Now unless you've got a hill, and a set speed ( sharp corner at bottom ) to start from, find somewhere you can do such a test.... This will ultimately let you see an improvement which might not be more peak power but a greater area under the curve thus real world improvement.

So AFR gauge is good, with stock ecu we know it running the injectors at 100% the fuel pump is good. Unless you want to do a full temp sensor test over a range of values, I'd say original map was done with a bad AFR gauge.
The 8% less output is most likely them having a bad SAE correction for temp of the day

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Darryl

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Darryl