Found this on a cylinderhead seems not the usual Toyota finish for a valve bucket shim. guess what it came out causing other problems.

Ummm! Not good.
I would hazard a guess that this happened to an ST185 CS with a forged engine.
The cause being a sticking valve spring.

_________________
Vice Chairman
1990 White UK Celica ST185 - Project DTM
1997 Cream BMW R1200C (as seen in James Bond "Tomorrow Never Dies")
2005 Jaguar X-type 3.0 Sovereign AWD Automatic
Blood Bikes - https://www.freewheelers.org.uk/

another product of "yee-ha engine works" then.

How much are shims? Is it really worth trying to grind one down? I am sure it coudl be done and finished so as to not cause any issues - but erghh that is shocking.

_________________
JP
GT4DC Treasurer

Grey St185 RC
Silver BMW E46 M3
Multicolour yawn Honda VFR400
Silver Honda Civic Type-R

My guess in a previous post is pure speculation.
(Perhaps datajon can enlighten us).
It's based on a known problem with 400+ bhp ST185's and shims literally flicking out of their seats. That's why it's advised to go for the shimless bucket conversion.

It's not unusual to find shims that have been skimmed to size in race prepared engines - I have heard that it is common practice.
However, the finish on that one is shocking.
I wouldn't have thought that the shim itself caused a problem - more like compounded to a problem.

_________________
Vice Chairman
1990 White UK Celica ST185 - Project DTM
1997 Cream BMW R1200C (as seen in James Bond "Tomorrow Never Dies")
2005 Jaguar X-type 3.0 Sovereign AWD Automatic
Blood Bikes - https://www.freewheelers.org.uk/

shim cam out due to rough surface, poor adhesion due to the *bleep* surface thats what went on..

the spring failed from impact from the shim jamming between bucket and camshaft lob..

even found the impact spot on piston...nothing gets pass me..


SPRING DID NOT FAIL CAUSING THE PROBLEM FACT. , its clear as day what went on.

muddy water you have no idea, you don't understand whats gone on.

the ra for a cam shim should be low, that surface finish is over 300 please don't tell me to suck eggs when you know jack about what it should be.

i am fully aware of the rev issues with the 3sgte..

the fact is they ground the shim down to the size, the fact is it caused the problem, the fact is i have all the broken parts, the fact is i fully understand how to work things out like this , fact is i even get paid for this sort of stuff, fact is you know jack and you should wise up, its not speculation its hard facts, so be careful who you use when it comes to this sort of work.

Hi Jon,

I don't think Nigel was having a pop at you, he seemed to be just having a guess at what might be the cause.



I also think that he genuinely wanted you to make further comment regarding the shim, and was not trying to provoke you.

Like you say you do this stuff all day, I don't think many of us would dispute your knowledge and where there are questions, its always meant as genuine interest for reasoned debate.

I for one get loads of stuff wrong and am happy to be corrected, but I like to learn so am always intererested to learn why something works differently to how I thought.

Cheers,

Mike

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GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK

Thanks Mike.

...that's exactly right!
Sorry you took it the wrong way DJ you obviously misunderstood what I wrote.


I was only GUESSING what might of happened based on the evidence provided.
I didn't have all the details, engine or bits in front of me.

_________________
Vice Chairman
1990 White UK Celica ST185 - Project DTM
1997 Cream BMW R1200C (as seen in James Bond "Tomorrow Never Dies")
2005 Jaguar X-type 3.0 Sovereign AWD Automatic
Blood Bikes - https://www.freewheelers.org.uk/

sorry muddywater...I was ott with my remarks..

I measured a few springs from the cylinderhead.

static height 44.25mm

at 34.25mm = 22.0 - 22.5 kg = stock spring based on two samples.

few more images




stock 140,000 miles of service

Must admit get a similar finish using the bandsaw cutting 3.25" steel bar..

I've got a nice barsteward file at home Jon if you wan't to go for a better finish next time

Thanks for posting the pics DJ,

Its especially interesting to see the 140k mile stock shim!

_________________
GT4DC Events Co-ordinator
1996 ST205 UK

Apologies accepted.
Must have caught you at a bad moment.
Mind you, if I'd come across this I wouldn't be very happy either, especially as shims aren't that expensive.


Please excuse my ignorance, but ...
Do I read this as static height 44.25mm and 34.25mm with a 22/22.5 kg load?

Do I assume that you found stock springs in the head?

_________________
Vice Chairman
1990 White UK Celica ST185 - Project DTM
1997 Cream BMW R1200C (as seen in James Bond "Tomorrow Never Dies")
2005 Jaguar X-type 3.0 Sovereign AWD Automatic
Blood Bikes - https://www.freewheelers.org.uk/

just an update.

found more problems with this said head that was installed by the said person.

all the buckets are worn, some shims have worn badly..

rest of the cylinder head is okay, just buckets & shims that are not okay.